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 Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so!

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txbhunter1@sbcglobal

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Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so! - Saturday, July 18, 2009 8:13 AM ( #1 )
 
 
 
It's every deer lover's nightmare: giant, drugged-up whitetail bucks wandering around the countryside, their antlers so large the deer can hardly hold up their heads, dwarfing every true trophy that's gone before.

Every big buck and every contest winner would be suspect, every working man's trophy diminished. Every record would carry an asterisk. Like baseball in the steroids era.

Those bucks won't be grown with steroids, one expert said, though there is enough concern about the unrestricted use of antibiotics and other compounds that the state's White-tailed Deer Advisory Committee recently discussed the issue.

The discussion began focused on scientific deer in breeder pens and quickly spread to free-ranging whitetails, said Dr. Ken Waldrup, a veterinarian with the Department of State Health Services in El Paso. Waldrup and Clayton Wolf — Texas Parks and Wildlife's Big Game Program Director — both said that there's no way to know what, if any, danger there is to Texas deer.

"We have no data to look at," Wolf said. "There's a lot of speculation. Some have voiced the concern that anabolic steroids might be used (to enhance antler growth.) We just don't track that stuff, but people talk about it because they hear it through the grapevine."

Waldrup, who has studied white-tailed deer for decades, said there could be some public health issues if deer treated with antibiotics in pens were released and killed and eaten shortly thereafter. However, the threat of growing big deer with hormones or testosterones is overblown, he said, and there's no practical application that would work.

"If you had asked, 'Can it be done?' then I would have had to answer, 'Yes.' In order to do this, one must use drugs forbidden in food animals by FDA because of the concern about their consumption by humans," Waldrup said.

"Please let me quickly add that anabolic steroids (i.e. like those used by Jose Canseco and others) will not do it," he said. "At the meeting, I went through a short diagram showing how anabolic steroids could shorten or even stop antler growth rather than lengthening it.

"Anybody using anabolic steroids to potentially increase antler growth does not understand male deer physiology. Anabolic steroids also have all of the side effects in deer that they do in people, like joint damage and decreased sperm production (not a good thing for a breeding male)."

Waldrup also said that even restricted and banned drugs that might work to increase the size of a deer's antlers won't work miracles.

"Even when I say that it can be done, please let me qualify that by pointing out that you cannot take a 6-point basket rack yearling and make him a 200 class 14-point as a 2.5 year old," he said. "To my knowledge, drugs could only increase antler mass by maybe 10-15 percent at best, and even that decreases as the buck gets older."

Deer breeders in Texas have put their best bucks on a rocket ride north in terms of the size of their antlers and their value to other breeders. Deer have sold for more than half a million dollars already. But the basic belief is that those deer were grown through genetic engineering, matching good genes with better genes to produce huge racks. The real danger, Wolf said, is in the indiscriminate use of antibiotics and drugs to treat worms administered in feed.

"My concern is not the drugs used by a licensed vet, but the use across the landscape of antibiotics and de-wormers in feed," Wolf said. "I don't really know to what degree that's occurring, but there are drugs that anybody can go down and buy."

But a number of deer raised in pens are being released into the wild each year and eventually hunted, Wolf said, and the retention of those drugs in tissue could be an issue for anyone who eats the venison.

Emphasize "could" in the that sentence, because even though some compounds could remain in the deer, there's no way of knowing wh
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Gary Scheel
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Bowman_No4

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RE: Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so! - Saturday, July 18, 2009 11:14 AM ( #2 )
I like my venison juicy.  Not juiced!  I would be afraid of one of those juiced up bucks going into "Roid Rage" and kicking my butt because I shot it with a pointy stick!!!
Love playing that string music and sending a Muzzy flying!
txbhunter1@sbcglobal

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RE: Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so! - Saturday, July 18, 2009 12:18 PM ( #3 )
NO kidding. This is not a natural occurance in nature so I would have to stay away also.  Ugly a$$ rack also!!!!!
Gary Scheel
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TheExtremeArcher

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RE: Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so! - Saturday, July 18, 2009 2:38 PM ( #4 )
I do not get it at all!!!  The white-tailed deer is one of God's most impressive creations, yet there is always some bonehead out there that thinks he or she can improve on perfection while on the mindless and shameless quest of the "almighty dollar".
 
In my honest opinion, GREED does more damage to the world than any other of the Deadly Sins.  This story literally turns my stomach.
 
Take care and Good Hunting!
 
Best Afield,
 
Steve 
 
 
weyyeager

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RE: Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so! - Saturday, July 18, 2009 7:46 PM ( #5 )
 In the 70`s we would have the vet inject Growth hormones into our beef cattle we thought it was the greatest thing ever, The weight to gain ratio on the steers went through the roof. Dont know if it would affect antler growth but it would make a 200 Lb. Buck a 450 Lb. Buck in a short order. Then they said something about food chain not good for humans Bla Bla Bla any way they made us quit using it a long time ago. They already know what it will do. it will travel through the food chain guaranteed.
orduckhunter

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RE: Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so! - Saturday, July 18, 2009 10:09 PM ( #6 )

ORIGINAL: weyyeager

 In the 70`s we would have the vet inject Growth hormones into our beef cattle we thought it was the greatest thing ever, The weight to gain ratio on the steers went through the roof. Dont know if it would affect antler growth but it would make a 200 Lb. Buck a 450 Lb. Buck in a short order. Then they said something about food chain not good for humans Bla Bla Bla any way they made us quit using it a long time ago. They already know what it will do. it will travel through the food chain guaranteed.


but, like they say, "you can't eat horns!"

for those guys who don't care about anything but antlers - they'll do anything to get 'em!
kwhitten

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RE: Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so! - Saturday, July 18, 2009 11:13 PM ( #7 )
I just know I have personal experience with 200" bucks that are 100% naturally corn and bean fed brutes. These bad boys are all different, but all beautiful and perfect. Why do we have to do anything to change that?
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
Thomas Jefferson

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snytrophyhunter

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RE: Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so! - Sunday, July 19, 2009 11:02 AM ( #8 )
Juiced up, just like high fence doesn't do it for me, but could you imagine if you were in the wild and a Deer, even half the size of this one suddenly appeared from the bush. Heart attack time.
The freshest tracks still have feet in them.
txbhunter1@sbcglobal

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RE: Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so! - Sunday, July 19, 2009 11:18 AM ( #9 )
This subject has been talked about before, many times. My opinion is let "ma nature" do what she wants to, and "leave her alone" doing it.  PERIOD!!!!!!!!!!
Gary Scheel
NAHC LM,RMEF LM,NRA Member, Lonestar Bowhunter, TexasHogHunter Pro Staff Member
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RE: Juiced-up ... deer? Say it ain't so! - Sunday, July 19, 2009 11:41 AM ( #10 )
It will be a sad day when this gets into the bloodlines of any deer!!
Gary Scheel
NAHC LM,RMEF LM,NRA Member, Lonestar Bowhunter, TexasHogHunter Pro Staff Member

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